Darkness Embraced Forums

For the past few years I have felt increasingly connected to Lucifer, whatever he/it is.

I have been trying to discover much about him on my own, but have also started to think that knowing outside information (or misinformation, as it might be) would help me greatly with my connection with him. One thing I discovered is that when I 'hear' Lucifer, it is a perfected version of my voice. I was surprised to read of another person 'hearing' him the same way. It is really hard to find other's perspectives of Lucifer, even more so to find anything that isn't christian based (Some may argue that Lucifer is based of christian mythology, and will be based on christian beliefs. Just to clear things up, I see him as being defamed by christian mythology to keep their followers from seeing his truths.)

Has anyone ever felt connected to Lucifer, or another chronically misunderstood entity/thought form/what-ever-it-may-be? If so (and you don't mind sharing), what do you think caused your connection? Have you found any good books, articles, blogs, communities or websites that show Lucifer in a light that you feel is correct for him? Has anyone ever had a negative or positive experience with Lucifer?

Thank you so much for taking the time to read this. Feel free to ask me any questions!

First I must answer your question with another question. Or rather, a series of questions.

Do you mean Lucifer as in the Devil?  Or do you mean some other deity out there that has nothing to do with Christianity?  Or the Lucifer in the Catholic Holy Bible that was historically a "translation" for someone else who was oppressing the Jews?  I am not sure what you are trying to say here. 


Please let me know as soon as possible.

Sincerely,
TheRadiantSeraphim

The concept/ archtype/ deity form of Lucifer doesn't resonate for me personally, but it/He does for many people.  You might want to look into Lucifrian paganism or Lucifrian magic. 

In the story of the Fall that we get from Milton, Lucifer is seem as an almost heroic figure because he opposes the status quo and stands up for what he wants, no matter the cost. In "The Marriage of Heaven and Hell", by William Blake, the Devil is seen in a similar light.  One early version of the devil in Hebrew mythology saw him not so much as an evil being, but as an "opponent", one who challenges us. 

The devil or Lucifer can be seen as one of the forms of the Trickster deity archtype, and as such could be seen as one who challenges us to think "outside the box" and one who shakes things up when there needs to be change.  I think that in Candolble (and maybe in some forms of Voodoo?) the deity who respresents the Trickster and the Guardian of Crossroads and borders between the worlds is represented by the Devil.  Do an Internet search on "Eshu",  "Exu" and "Guardian of Crossroads".  This association may be why we have the legend of the musician who sold his soul to the Devil at the crossroads.

The Guardian of Crossroads is a deity archtype who has resonance for me. Some of his/her many forms are as Anubis, Hermes, Hecate, Loki, Eshu, Legba, Raven and Coyote.

 - Persephone

Well, I do not believe that the Lucifer of Christianity is necessarily the same as the deities noted, or even a "pagan Lucifer."  I say this because the concepts are not necessarily the same.  Maybe the Catholic Church might have used the satyr appearance of Pan to symbolize the devil in the past, but otherwise, it is not the same thing as far as I am concerned.

Mind you, I am no Christian, but from what I understand, the Lucifer in Christianity is much more malicious, whether you are referring to the historical Lucifer or the devil Lucifer.  I do not see Anubis as an asura, for instance, in terms of Hindu mythological fiends who represent selfishness and desire.  For me, he would be like the god Yama, or the one other person who watched for the dead in Christian literature...that I cannot remember the name of. 

I think it is prudent to make this distinction, at least for the face value.  I do not say this to offend, but it might want to be something clarified for we have people of different backgrounds here.


As for myself, I have felt connected to Kali ma.  But she was never meant to be the murderous, malicious sex and death deity that is found in the Britannica.  She is barely even the Western feminist icon that many Westerners made her out to be.  She is a much different deity from what I grew to understand.  Perhaps one day, I can make an article on her with some citations drawn from her more Eastern version. 



Sincerely,
TheRadiantSeraphim

TheRadiantSeraphim, Thank you for your quick reply. In response to your questions, I have a hard time explaining who or what I see Lucifer as. He is not a devil, not a man, more like a specific force based in, on, and surrounding Truth in so many aspects. He is very knowledgeable and wants to share his knowledge with as many people as possible. Sadly it seems as if the knowledge he imparts upon me, while true, is purposefully being kept from the people and has been for some time. I hope I am describing this clearly enough. I have a hard time putting my thoughts into words.

Persephone - Thank you for your reply as well. I actually have looked into Luciferianism. It is very hard to find information on, yet quite a bit that I have read seems pretty accurate in my feelings of Lucifer. Thanks also for your description of the trickster archetype. I do see how my connection to Lucifer could be based around such an archetype's role in teaching me things that I am meant to learn in this current point in my life.

Thank you both for your time and assistance. =)

 I am in agreement with Persephone on this point. If you look at the Christian concept of Satan it is of one who is At odds with all that is supposedly good and benevolent, but Satan himself was one of the high Angels of the Lord in his inception. Sammael, the first created and the most powerful and skilled of all the host. His fall resulted not from any overtly evil act, but simply from the fact that he chose to exercise his free will and not blindly follow the rest in their worship of the One.

 Since we value free will, and give high praise to those who exercise this will in their personal lives, then you might say that we all follow in the teachings of he who was the first to advance this concept. It would seem that the Christian concept of Heaven therefore is one of a totalitarian state, where disagreement with the powers that be results in, condemnation, and imprisonment.

 If the right to freely express myself is a trait that the One cannot fathom or accept, then my sympathies lie with who brought forth these concepts in the first place

I have to agree with pathfinder. The reason satan fell is because he had and used his free will. And that happend because "the one" gave adam and eve power than satan had.

I would say that I have been drawn in the sense that Lucifer is the Lightbringer.
He shows the way and sets the example of self-betterment, intelligence, and freedom.
For me he shows a path and requires no worship.
It is a personal choice to do so in my opinion.

I echo that. I see Lucifer as the Morningstar, the one who lights the path. I experience him as the grounding force in my life, the one who counsels thus: Advancing further down my path means fully embracing this world instead of trying to rise "above" it.

I do not associate him with any religion, although I do see him as an angelic being, a Seraph of sorts.

 Ah Lucifer, one of the little lies created by Christians/Catholics to induce fear into the hearts of humanity.

  It seems more like a fabrication based off the Babylonian king, kind of like the association of Dracula with Vlad Tepes.

I am in total agreement with Erych.  :yesnod:

I don't believe in Lucifer or that it exist. I do believe that there are souls that have evil tendencies, but I don't believe it is because Lucifer is in their ear telling them to do bad deeds. Evil, in my opinion, exist only on this side of life. When we die and go forward there is no evil, no negativity. That is why we come here (earth) to experience all the things we can't on the other side.   :thumbsup:

*I've moved this to Science, History, and Religion since there doesn't seem to be anything pertaining to Magic in the initial post (and hopefully get more hits on the topic for discussion).*

I believe the devil is an angel, that have a rather nastie job....

I believe beyond good and evil.

But I believe that they are very nasty souls that call themselves these names, in order to either flourish they ill-thought plan or to attract as much intention as possible...

"I remember when I read Memnoch the demon (Anne Rice a Lestat story) and the scene when the devil and god are playing chess and the devil complains to god how rash the job was, that he had kind of enough of it...."

On the other end I would accept that every being have a seed of evil or wild doing evil, create a being of some sort a consciousness that we would call the Beast, not the devil because it would be so primal, so brutal and selfish, like evil often is!

For me Lucifer stands for positive things. Like exploration, freedom, individuality and taking risks, which is some of the qualities and thoughts that I hold dear.

I also hear my own voice perfected in my thoughts, but I don't hear or believe it as being Lucifer or anything else, but otherwise I am confident that I could indoctrinate myself to believe in it. The mind is a powerful tool.

  It's a bit of a shame this subject hasn't recieved more discussion, so I'll try and bring up the bit I know.

 sigiel brought up a note worthy point because Lucifer is/was an angel, as some others near the top of this thread mentioned. Spurn brings up some points that some Satanist and Luciferians hold value in, and based off the old myths it's understandable why Lucifer may be an admired being.

  However there is one huge problem with this ideology and that is Lucifer did not have free will, none of the angels did. How is it that Lucifer revolted against god when he didn't have free will? A big reason why Lucifer revolted was because god gave mankind free will, and if Lucifer and the other angels had free will they wouldn't have revolted because there would not have been quite as much animosity towards god for loving mankind so much, and there wouldn't be the jealosy factor of mankind having free will.

 It just doesn't add up right. Another thing to consider is actually a point my wife's boss brought up who is a long time Catholic (so-so in his faith now), but hell wouldn't necassarily be a place of hatred and torture because Lucifer is quite possibly more upset about god betraying him for loving mankind more. It's quite possible that hell is more of a depressive place where Lucifer dwells, a place of sorrow,depression and misery and although that may seem very similar to what we've all been taught hell is like, it may be very differant.

Though you have a good and well thought out point, my wonderful Erych, I actually said that about Hell, not my boss Ricky.

My boss actually said Heaven would be a horrible place because the angels detest us. All for God's more fierce love of such fragile, weak willed creatures rather than his first sentient creation. Heaven would essentially be Hell.

Not to mention, yes, we were granted free will and ran rampant with the gift, while the angels were not. Mind you it's true, he, (Ricky)  was raised Catholic, but then again so was I and now I'm a regular heathen.

My boss isn't the first to realize and, ha ha, "bring to light" this point. I highly suggest any interested in the topic read, yes, a graphic novel, titled "Preacher".

Besides that, it was brought to my attention and I double checked it, but apparently Lucifer was also an insane Babylonian king.

Another note worthy mention, I believe it is Jesus who is in fact quoted saying, "I am Lucifer", or in other words, "I am the light of morning." How very odd, yes?

Personally, I can't acknowledge the actual existence of such a deity, for to do so would mean that I must acknowledge a Hebrew/Catholic God, which I do not. 

However, I confess to being enthralled, even obsessed with the arch type. A being put through so much suffering, denied and condemned by his own "father",  all for having different ideals and despite his alleged inability to act upon it, (another contradiction or else he could not have revolted in the first place) felt betrayed and forsaken long before his fall.

As a footnote, I also suggest anyone interested in Theology regardless of the specifics, look into the documentary "Zeitgeist".

Lucifer as an archetype is very interesting. The original rebel, the fire of passion and change that is within us all if we just care to admit it. A very positive archetype for me. :)
Lucifer as an actual entity? Never, not for me.